"The fans wanted him sacked"

[Pippi Longstocking]

I remember when HK bought Reid and Gray - nobody thought they were anything that special.So its notlike HK had a good side that needed just two big names to make it great. My point is that RM could get a couple of half decent players in during the summer who just 'click'.
I also think RM needs a #2 who does not htink the way he does and who offers a differnet view maybe then he would have a plan B.

 

[banno]

Have a look what Ferguson had done in Scotland before he went to UTD, he had proved himself as a top Drawer manager. That's what it has to do with it.

As did Walter Smith. So tell me where we can get a manager with proven success (FA Cup apparently doesn't count) (Basically making a lowly team like Swansea what they are today doesn't count either) to come to Everton. Catterick was a promising Manager, Kendall was a promising manager, Joe Royle etc etc. When have we ever got a manager with proven success besides Walter Smith. Martinez was more successful than all of them,(bar Smith) didn't Joe Royle take Oldham down. Time is needed not the axe, he has been here 5 mins and given us a record league points and its not going so well this season despite being the last british team in the euro league and people suddenly revert back to taking pauper wigan down to being a sh!t manager.

 

[roydo]

As did Walter Smith. So tell me where we can get a manager with proven success (FA Cup apparently doesn't count) (Basically making a lowly team like Swansea what they are today doesn't count either) to come to Everton. Catterick was a promising Manager, Kendall was a promising manager, Joe Royle etc etc. When have we ever got a manager with proven success besides Walter Smith. Martinez was more successful than all of them,(bar Smith) didn't Joe Royle take Oldham down. Time is needed not the axe, he has been here 5 mins and given us a record league points and its not going so well this season despite being the last british team in the euro league and people suddenly revert back to taking pauper wigan down to being a sh!t manager.

Bloody good points them.

 

[davek]

It is, a manager, who is very media friendly, full of quotes, tried to play exciting football, was a massive contributing factor to a team leaving the PL

Oh boy.

That clinches it them.

 

[craighuytonblue]

As did Walter Smith. So tell me where we can get a manager with proven success (FA Cup apparently doesn't count) (Basically making a lowly team like Swansea what they are today doesn't count either) to come to Everton. Catterick was a promising Manager, Kendall was a promising manager, Joe Royle etc etc. When have we ever got a manager with proven success besides Walter Smith. Martinez was more successful than all of them,(bar Smith) didn't Joe Royle take Oldham down. Time is needed not the axe, he has been here 5 mins and given us a record league points and its not going so well this season despite being the last british team in the euro league and people suddenly revert back to taking pauper wigan down to being a sh!t manager.

I agree to give Martinez time to show what he's made of til christmas and re evaluate, if nothing has changed and we are struggling, we need to replace before the Jan transfer window and my choice if any would be villas boas (a proven manager who still has a point to prove in the prem after taking charge of chelsea and spuds and not being given enough time to influence their respective teams due to owners who want instant results!)

 

[magicjuan]

Time is the point here. Martinez is running out of time to turn things around this season, he has to start this weekend or I reckon the atmosphere will be too sour for him to do the job the way he wants, he'll force himself out.

It's way past the time to sack him, that would have an adverse affect, reckon we'd go into freefall. Who would take on the badket cade that is us? Anyone worth their salt wouldn't risk their reputation this late, have to be existing staff, who knows how much a part of the problem thry are?

We've just got to tough it out till the end of the season, we'll know exactly where we stand and exactly what is needed. If that's in the championship, tough caca, we deal with it, not much else we can do, apathy has become a hallmark for about 14 years now...

 

[ianefc]

As did Walter Smith. So tell me where we can get a manager with proven success (FA Cup apparently doesn't count) (Basically making a lowly team like Swansea what they are today doesn't count either) to come to Everton. Catterick was a promising Manager, Kendall was a promising manager, Joe Royle etc etc. When have we ever got a manager with proven success besides Walter Smith. Martinez was more successful than all of them,(bar Smith) didn't Joe Royle take Oldham down. Time is needed not the axe, he has been here 5 mins and given us a record league points and its not going so well this season despite being the last british team in the euro league and people suddenly revert back to taking pauper wigan down to being a sh!t manager.

Cant compare, Smith and Rangers to What Ferguson did at Aberdeen, Royle may have taken Oldham down but in their 2nd crack at the top flight, wigan were established, Even Bruce and Jewell didn't relegate wigan, Winning the FA cup was a great achievement, but for every bit that that was great this is poor, he has been a PL manager for 6 full seasons almost and 5 of those have been fighting relegation, he is not a SH T manager just a poor one and he doenst belong at Everton, I have acknowledged that unless he takes us down he will not be sacked, no point in even calling for his head because of that (as I don't think we will be going down) But the Feguson analogy is futile as what he did at Aberdeen to break the Glasgow choke hold on Scottish football and win a European trophy over a few years is so much more than Martinez winning the FA Cup whilst relegating an established premier league team.

 

[Ruairi77]

Cant compare, Smith and Rangers to What Ferguson did at Aberdeen, Royle may have taken Oldham down but in their 2nd crack at the top flight, wigan were established, Even Bruce and Jewell didn't relegate wigan, Winning the FA cup was a great achievement, but for every bit that that was great this is poor, he has been a PL manager for 6 full seasons almost and 5 of those have been fighting relegation, he is not a SH T manager just a poor one and he doenst belong at Everton, I have acknowledged that unless he takes us down he will not be sacked, no point in even calling for his head because of that (as I don't think we will be going down) But the Feguson analogy is futile as what he did at Aberdeen to break the Glasgow choke hold on Scottish football and win a European trophy over a few years is so much more than Martinez winning the FA Cup whilst relegating an established premier league team.

I think the analogy was less Martinez v Ferguson and more a point about how fickle football fans call it wrong as much as they get it right.

 

[bicycleheader]

You keep going on about the points tally from last year, Well what about this points tally.

in fairness to him I think he is generally, when not running off to extremes, making a fair point that you should judge him on last season AND this season which would give some kind of balance and suggest giving a manager ,who is taking over from somebody who'd been here a decade, some time and see what he can do.

I know you personally may feel the signs from this season point to get rid, but I'm sure you can see the above is an extremely normal and understandable viewpoint also.

 

[ianefc]

I think the analogy was less Martinez v Ferguson and more a point about how fickle football fans call it wrong as much as they get it right.

Don't buy that mate, certain posters keep going on about other posters never wanting Martinez, and there was a reason for that, his prior form, whereas to turn on Ferguson after what he had achieved in his previous employment could be seen as being fickle, anyhow as ive said there is no way that Martinez Won't be here at the start of next season, so lets hope he gets it right for the sake of everton as every wrong decision tactically or in the transfer market can and will have damaging effects on evertons near future so lets hope he is the answer.

 

[bicycleheader]

its like both parties only read part of the others post and willingly pick out they bits they want, so they can jump on the others point and no discussion never ends with any agreed upon parts.

surely you are not doing that guys?




...guys?

 

[ianefc]

in fairness to him I think he is generally, when not running off to extremes, making a fair point that you should judge him on last season AND this season which would give some kind of balance and suggest giving a manager ,who is taking over from somebody who'd been here a decade, some time and see what he can do.

I know you personally may feel the signs from this season point to get rid, but I'm sure you can see the above is an extremely normal and understandable viewpoint also.

If he had got us that points tally and postion from nowhere near it in previous seasons then yes, but i'm of the school of thought that Moyes Back 5 had a lot to do with last season, that's slumped now as players have got older as have we, I mean we haven't scored in 5 of our last 7 games, 2 wins in the last 16 PL games, 11 wins in our last 42 competitive games, these are worring stats, name another manager who is considered to be 'one of the better ones' who has ever posted stats like that.

 

[bicycleheader]

As did Walter Smith. So tell me where we can get a manager with proven success (FA Cup apparently doesn't count) (Basically making a lowly team like Swansea what they are today doesn't count either) to come to Everton. Catterick was a promising Manager, Kendall was a promising manager, Joe Royle etc etc. When have we ever got a manager with proven success besides Walter Smith. Martinez was more successful than all of them,(bar Smith) didn't Joe Royle take Oldham down. Time is needed not the axe, he has been here 5 mins and given us a record league points and its not going so well this season despite being the last british team in the euro league and people suddenly revert back to taking pauper wigan down to being a sh!t manager.

amazingly well put post...

 

[ianefc]

its like both parties only read part of the others post and willingly pick out they bits they want, so they can jump on the others point and no discussion never ends with any agreed upon parts.

surely you are not doing that guys?




...guys?

the only one who does that is @davek and it couldn't be clearer even in this short thread, I can show you if you want, I got a thread reply from @banno where he made some good points even other posters said so, and I tried to answer all of them, I asked @davek whether he trust Martinez in the market to which he never replied

 

[bicycleheader]

If he had got us that points tally and postion from nowhere near it in previous seasons then yes, but i'm of the school of thought that Moyes Back 5 had a lot to do with last season, that's slumped now as players have got older as have we, I mean we haven't scored in 5 of our last 7 games, 2 wins in the last 16 PL games, 11 wins in our last 42 competitive games, these are worring stats, name another manager who is considered to be 'one of the better ones' who has ever posted stats like that.

even if you dont rate last seasons achievement as highly as others....it still brings the "average" of the two seasons up...and makes it more reasonable that some people think he should be given time.

I know most of your points about why he should be sacked. I am just asking for it to be acknowledged that the opposite viewpoint is also understandable.

It would be better than the constant stamping on each others viewpoints and the discussion spinning around in circles and going nowhere.