Who should be starting keeper vs. Sunderland

[bluestevon]

Don't do it to yourself mate

It's the hope that kills

Everton - Saints final mate, VVD to score a last minute winner for them...

 

[GwladysBlue]

90.3% for Robles and 3.1% for Howard lol

 

[Dithering Dougie]

I agree with Doug.
I think with such an inexperienced back four the manager will opt for the experience of Howard. I think I would do the same myself if I were manager.

I say this, even though I thought Robles should have kept his place last season and at the moment believing that he is a better keeper than Howard. I think Robles is going to be an excellent keeper for us over the next number of seasons.

But, with youngsters like Stones and Galloway in defence and Funes Mori still inexperienced in this league I would stay with Howard for the present.

It's the obvious and sensible thing mate, how some can't see that is beyond me.

 

[Dithering Dougie]

90.3% for Robles and 3.1% for Howard lol

Sad reflection on modern football fans the last poll last week Howard won.

 

[davek]

Dave i agree with you on a lot of things but not this one, look at the sqauds body language on the pitch with Howard and with Robles - think the squad is already soured with the decision to stay with him

Will you think it's smart management should Howard make bad errors against Sunderland that give them the win mate? or Say he makes a mistake but the team bail him out with a 2-1 or something, eventually a manager has to show he has a pair of balls and no player comes before the good of the club, right now Martinez is being as brave as Howard is on any cross

Look at the Norwich goal last night: GK and defenders looking at each other about who was going to go for that ball that dropped at the feet of Bassong. They need sorting out as a unit.

Dont get me wrong: I want Howard out. I just doubt the wisdom of demoting him for the Sunderland game, and I doubt the overall quality of Robles. We need this sorted out in the summer (before then actually but there's no use wishing for that because it wont happen). If Howard makes a balls of it against Sunderland then it's an easy decision to make for RM and I'd find it hard to understand if he didn't then take it.

 

[matty1878]

Did somebody say Bossman?

He sadly died of a heart attack didn't he mate if I'm correct

 

[daz4matty]

Look at the Norwich goal last night: GK and defenders looking at each other about who was going to go for that ball that dropped at the feet of Bassong. They need sorting out as a unit.

Dont get me wrong: I want Howard out. I just doubt the wisdom of demoting him for the Sunderland game, and I doubt the overall quality of Robles. We need this sorted out in the summer (before then actually but there's no use wishing for that because it wont happen). If Howard makes a balls of it against Sunderland then it's an easy decision to make for RM and I'd find it hard to understand if he didn't then take it.

Howard needs dropping now mate.
Joel does not deserve to be left out after last night.

 

[davek]

Howard needs dropping now mate.
Joel does not deserve to be left out after last night.

We'll see. Personally I think it's a matter of RM orchestrating this in the right sequence. He has a squad of first team players he has to oversee and he'll know the strength of feeling about Howard in the dressing room.

I think RM will give Howard enough rope and let him underline just why things cant go on with him in goal. He has to do it that way with a senior pro in order to keep the peace. That's professional football politics.

 

[bluestevon]

Look at the Norwich goal last night: GK and defenders looking at each other about who was going to go for that ball that dropped at the feet of Bassong. They need sorting out as a unit.

Dont get me wrong: I want Howard out. I just doubt the wisdom of demoting him for the Sunderland game, and I doubt the overall quality of Robles. We need this sorted out in the summer (before then actually but there's no use wishing for that because it wont happen). If Howard makes a balls of it against Sunderland then it's an easy decision to make for RM and I'd find it hard to understand if he didn't then take it.

Then it's a coaching error and firmly on Martinez mate, end of the day if they don't know what they are doing as a unit then that's all it can be.

But to compound that flaw by then throwing Howard in who undermines confidence through the defence would be as idiotic as the reported stories we don't practise attacking or defending set pieces.

As for making the decision, on this forum it's like 95% in favour of Robles, the national media are slating Howard and criticising the decision and his own players look fed up with Howard for the best part of a year now, exactly who is he scared of?

 

[hetion]

I think Martinez just won't risk having a defence - and side - without Jags, Howard and Baines. That's all our respected experienced heads in the side apart from Barry. I can kind if understand it too.

It's a shame because I love Joel and I think he may have gotten his chance if we weren't without Jags and Baines.

 

[Furey1878]

Did somebody say Bossman?

Did somebody say Big Boss?

 

[daz4matty]

We'll see. Personally I think it's a matter of RM orchestrating this in the right sequence. He has a squad of first team players he has to oversee and he'll know the strength of feeling about Howard in the dressing room.

I think RM will give Howard enough rope and let him underline just why things cant go on with him in goal. He has to do it that way with a senior pro in order to keep the peace. That's professional football politics.

I think its gone to far with howard.
He needs taking out and building back up again,keeping him in the team as he is at the moment could ruin him.

 

[bluestevon]

We'll see. Personally I think it's a matter of RM orchestrating this in the right sequence. He has a squad of first team players he has to oversee and he'll know the strength of feeling about Howard in the dressing room.

I think RM will give Howard enough rope and let him underline just why things cant go on with him in goal. He has to do it that way with a senior pro in order to keep the peace. That's professional football politics.

Did he also give Alcaraz enough rope last season against Kiev mate, or does he just make at times absolutely appaling decisions with players he likes and somehow rates when no one else does?

If it takes Howard dropping us 3,4,5,6 or more points for Martinez to make the decision to drop him then he isn't the manager i hoped he would be, and he isn't the manager that will ever take this club anywhere mate.

Never seen a top class manager actually afraid of making a decision this bloody obvious - especially in the most vital position of a team

 

[bluestevon]

I think its gone to far with howard.
He needs taking out and building back up again,keeping him in the team as he is at the moment could ruin him.

i like your sneakiness mate

 

[davek]

Then it's a coaching error and firmly on Martinez mate, end of the day if they don't know what they are doing as a unit then that's all it can be.

But to compound that flaw by then throwing Howard in who undermines confidence through the defence would be as idiotic as the reported stories we don't practise attacking or defending set pieces.

As for making the decision, on this forum it's like 95% in favour of Robles, the national media are slating Howard and criticising the decision and his own players look fed up with Howard for the best part of a year now, exactly who is he scared of?

So if he were to bench Howard it'd look like he was following the diktat of the media. I'm sure that'd go down well in the dressing room.

It's a perception that the team are fed up with Howard. You dont know that. They might think that overall he's got the history that backs up his status as number 1. We just dont know and because of that it's hard to judge exactly how quickly Martinez needs to act in this situation.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

It's actually smart management to hand Howard back the GK jersey for Sunday.

Martinez knows the pressure is right on Howard now to up his game. There's no hiding place after any poor performance he might put in against Sunderland, as he has the form of Robles to point to in order to drop him on a reasonable footing. Howard simply HAS to perform, and RM knows that in the past he's responded in these situations and put a run of form together. I back him to do exactly that.

The manager has to deal with the politics of a situation - and a GK position is a very tricky one to get right without souring a whole squad. Howard is a huge presence in the dressing room and would need to be have to be seen to have blown a last chance in order for it to sit right with the squad that he should be demoted.

Lastly, let's have it right: Robles is decent, but it's far from a no brainer that he comes in. He's not top notch. That also has to be on RMs mind. And he knows Robles well enough to have his respect if he continues to back Howard over him...for the time being.

In short: it's a bit more complex than just hooking Howard and promoting Robles.

It can't help Robles confidence though to put in that sort of performance and get dropped straight back down to the bench

If that sort of performance can't get him another start, he'll have to be wondering what will

 

[davek]

Did he also give Alcaraz enough rope last season against Kiev mate, or does he just make at times absolutely appaling decisions with players he likes and somehow rates when no one else does?

If it takes Howard dropping us 3,4,5,6 or more points for Martinez to make the decision to drop him then he isn't the manager i hoped he would be, and he isn't the manager that will ever take this club anywhere mate.

Never seen a top class manager actually afraid of making a decision this bloody obvious - especially in the most vital position of a team

A player not retained, so the answer to that is yes - regardless of what he said about his performances last season. Actions speak louder than words.

I must say I'm surprised at the one dimensional approach you're taking here. You know the situation with a GK is fraught with difficulty at any top club. It's a pivotal positon: get it wrong and there's discontent. It's not avoiding responsibility by Martinez, it's about judging a) what the available alternatives are (not great, imo with Robles) and b ) where the mood of the first team squad lies.

You know it's complex and not simple.