Transfer Rumour Wilfried Gnonto

[Eggs]

Whose that mate?

 

[Zatara]

Zat you need to stop selling Beto in these posts, we can’t afford to sell him until next year at the earliest….

Any sale now would have to be for more than we bought him for, who’s paying that?

You've totally lost me here...

Why would "any sale now would have to be for more than we bought him for".

That doesn't make any sense.

He was signed for £21.5mil with £4mil in add ons on a 4 year contract.

We could make a PSR profit at £16.2mil. An actual profit at £22mil.

So why do i "need" to stop spitting facts?

Everton sign Udinese striker Beto

Everton have signed Udinese striker Beto on a four-year contract. The Athletic reported on Sunday that the Premier League side had made positive progress in their bid to sign the 25-year-old, who will cost €25million (£21.5m, $27m) plus €5m in potential add-ons with no payment due until the next...

www.nytimes.com

 

[UltraVires]

You've totally lost me here...

Why would "any sale now would have to be for more than we bought him for".

That doesn't make any sense.

He was signed for £21.5mil with £4mil in add ons on a 4 year contract.

We could make a PSR profit at £16.2mil. An actual profit at £22mil.

So why do i "need" to stop spitting facts?

Everton sign Udinese striker Beto

Everton have signed Udinese striker Beto on a four-year contract. The Athletic reported on Sunday that the Premier League side had made positive progress in their bid to sign the 25-year-old, who will cost €25million (£21.5m, $27m) plus €5m in potential add-ons with no payment due until the next...

www.nytimes.com

Exactly. Some people still don’t understand that you divide the price paid by the length of contract and that’s how much the player costs per season and so each season that passes, you have to sell them by less that amount to break even.

A large portion still think if you buy a player for £50m on a 5 year contract and have him for 4 seasons and then sell for £40m, means you have lost £10m when in actual fact you have made a tidy profit £30m on the books

 

[Zatara]

Exactly. Some people still don’t understand that you divide the price paid by the length of contract and that’s how much the player costs per season and so each season that passes, you have to sell them by less that amount to break even.

A large portion still think if you buy a player for £50m on a 5 year contract and have him for 4 seasons and then sell for £40m, means you have lost £10m when in actual fact you have made a tidy profit £30m on the books

Exactly and the future numbers are always going to sit on the balance sheet so by selling, you open up those future payments on the balance sheet +/- on whatever the sales price may be. So thost funds can be re-used in a sense.

 

[MACCA75]

Exactly. Some people still don’t understand that you divide the price paid by the length of contract and that’s how much the player costs per season and so each season that passes, you have to sell them by less that amount to break even.

A large portion still think if you buy a player for £50m on a 5 year contract and have him for 4 seasons and then sell for £40m, means you have lost £10m when in actual fact you have made a tidy profit £30m on the books

You have still spent £50 million and recouped £40 million though. That’s what the books show over the 5 year period.

 

[Zatara]

You have still spent £50 million and recouped £40 million though. That’s what the books show over the 5 year period.

True, a bit different to the original point though.

Lets say we took that hit (as you say at a loss on the overall Beto 4 year contract) with a breakeven on the PSR for Beto.

We then invested the sum in Gnonto (with a little bit extra) whose value did increase over the next few seasons.

It's the best of both worlds.

If the club dont see Beto as a 12+ goals a season starter and I cant imagine we see DCL & Maupay as capable of scoring a dozen a season....they should be punted.

If we go off the approach where we want to invest in players who will increase in value then not one of those 3 fix the criteria.

 

[UltraVires]

You have still spent £50 million and recouped £40 million though. That’s what the books show over the 5 year period.

But you have had a player contributing to your team for four years which has a benefit.

 

[MikeH72]

You have still spent £50 million and recouped £40 million though. That’s what the books show over the 5 year period.

But during that period the player is contributing value on the pitch (in theory) so it isn’t that straightforward.

 

[JLW]

But during that period the player is contributing value on the pitch (in theory) so it isn’t that straightforward.

I think one of the clowns from sky explained this as few weeks ago.

If you sell a player for 50mil on your books its 50mil immediately on the books
If you sign a player for 50mil over 5 years its 10 mil a year outgoings on the books

Not sure how that works really but i think it was like that.

So when people say we cant afford a 40 mil player in theory its 10mil a year over 4 years.
So i guess the sale of Onana 50mil gives us a lot of room in the market.

 

[ToffeeTim]

I think one of the clowns from sky explained this as few weeks ago.

If you sell a player for 50mil on your books its 50mil immediately on the books
If you sign a player for 50mil over 5 years its 10 mil a year outgoings on the books

Not sure how that works really but i think it was like that.

So when people say we cant afford a 40 mil player in theory its 10mil a year over 4 years.
So i guess the sale of Onana 50mil gives us a lot of room in the market.

It's not necessarily 50m on books straight away. It depends on their book value when sold. If their book value is nothing, like say for an academy player, it's 50m. But if their book value is still 10m, you recognise a profit of 40m

 

[bluestevon]

I think one of the clowns from sky explained this as few weeks ago.

If you sell a player for 50mil on your books its 50mil immediately on the books
If you sign a player for 50mil over 5 years its 10 mil a year outgoings on the books

Not sure how that works really but i think it was like that.

So when people say we cant afford a 40 mil player in theory its 10mil a year over 4 years.
So i guess the sale of Onana 50mil gives us a lot of room in the market.

It does mate, but remember all the players you've signed whose outgoings are spread over the years are still ticking.

So before doing anything this year for example.

Maupay 5m
Onana 6m
Beto 6m
Garner 2-3m
Chermiti 3m
Patterson 3m
McNeil 3-4m
Tim 2-3m

So before doing anything this summer we are already starting from a net p&s point of minus 34-37 million or so. Now Lindstrom 2.5 and Ndiaye 3.5 added onto that and we are already between 40-43 million into the room we created by selling Onana (50m minus the sell on fee to Lyon of roughly 2.5m so 47.5m)

Maybe missed some there too.

So napkin math without any further sales we don't have 50m room, we have approximately 5-6m.

Not even going into the fact I think Onanas book value was 12m not 6m so that'd leave us pretty much at 0 after selling Onana.

 

[Simon Buttle]

It does mate, but remember all the players you've signed whose outgoings are spread over the years are still ticking.

So before doing anything this year for example.

Maupay 5m
Onana 6m
Beto 6m
Garner 2-3m
Chermiti 3m
Patterson 3m
McNeil 3-4m
Tim 2-3m

So before doing anything this summer we are already starting from a net p&s point of minus 34-37 million or so. Now Lindstrom 2.5 and Ndiaye 3.5 added onto that and we are already between 40-43 million into the room we created by selling Onana (50m minus the sell on fee to Lyon of roughly 2.5m so 47.5m)

Maybe missed some there too.

So napkin math without any further sales we don't have 50m room, we have approximately 5-6m.

Not even going into the fact I think Onanas book value was 12m not 6m so that'd leave us pretty much at 0 after selling Onana.

Our transfer incomings are higher than the transfer outgoings though and with some profit on top of it. Obviously we have made some purchases this window but also a large sale. I'm just glad it's not me that has to juggle the numbers and work it all out.

 

[bluestevon]

Utilising the way the money is tracked according to regulations is perfectly fine and allies certain creativity and short term maneuvering to be done.

Over time though it creates its own problems as can be seen above.

Essentially we are in a situation where we need a sale every season of roughly 40-50m to simply ensure we can break even with previous sessions transfers we have to balance out.

Any spending on top creates a negative and then on future seasons ensures that the cycle continues of having to sell to simply tread water

 

[bluestevon]

Our transfer incomings are higher than the transfer outgoings though and with some profit on top of it. Obviously we have made some purchases this window but also a large sale. I'm just glad it's not me that has to juggle the numbers and work it all out.

Yup but it's why people like zat suggesting selling and then throwing shed loads at a couple of players are frankly bonkers, yes initially for that season you can just about juggle the numbers, but the following seasons you've given yourself a massive car crash situation.

So say you offload 20m worth, you could in theory sign two 50m players over five year deals each and you'd break even, 20 incoming on the books, fievthst season 20 outgoings.

But for the next four seasons you're having to find 20m from player sales each season to just pay for those players.

It's why in great part the club is so financially screwed up with p&s.

Take the season we splurged 200m for the next 4/5 years we had 40/50m ticking on the books from that...

 

[jazzy]

Our transfer incomings are higher than the transfer outgoings though and with some profit on top of it. Obviously we have made some purchases this window but also a large sale. I'm just glad it's not me that has to juggle the numbers and work it all out.

Yep, they are this season and maybe next too if we sell Branthwaite but Zats policy dictates that you have to make a big sale every season and that's nowhere near a given.