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Will Martinez ever lead us to the Champions League?

Will Martinez lead us into the Champions League at any time during his tenure?

  • Yes

  • No

  • Selection of breads and cheeses

Results are only viewable after voting.
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I don't think Martinez will get us there but I think he will have put things in place that his successor will bear the fruits of ( such as youth, good first team squad ).

Personally I just don't think he gets the best out of the players at his disposal, certainly not enough consistently over the course of 38 games to break into the top 4. For me, other teams spending more than us is just as it is. If we go by that rule of thumb, our players all cost more and earn more money than Watfords team so why didn't we win? Tactics/playing style/substitutions/luck all play a part on getting the results required.

Only game this season where there was a difference in class was City and I still felt we didn't play to our full potential and still we had a couple of chances ourselves when the score was level.
 
bluestevon said:
How often did you see Baines at Garbutts age play mate, can tell you right now he wasn't anywhere near as good as he was at 25-26 for us. try comparing a 21-22 year old Garbutt to a similar age Baines is way fairer on the lad.

As for the others, I'm guessing you've not seen either Ledson, Kenny, Henen or Holgate more than once or twice if at all. As for Galloway maybe reserve judgement until you've seen him play his actual position instead of filling in at lb, i seem to remember Stones looked pretty poor as a rb for us in the few games he played their early on as well. The lad clearly has all the talent you would want - let him get some experience before casting judgement
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I don't remember seeing a 21 year old Baines getting rinsed by a genuine nonce.
 
Pabbers said:
Its not the manager that is stopping us, its finances.
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In the long run yes, but if a top manager had this squad I think it would get top 4. We should at least be challenging. We have more firepower than Spurs or Liverpool and a better defence yet we're absolutely nowhere near and floundered in the bottom half of the table last season. If Klopp took us over I believe we'd be fifth minimum and with the way Unired seem to stutter along why not a run at fourth? With Martinez though I fear there is no chance, we have already dropped 4 points this season in games a top 4 side would expect to win. Chelsea game will reveal a lot I think, a bad loss and we are heading for last season again. A win and we might ride a wave of confidence for a while. We need to show we can start winning at home again. Our record recently is terrible.
 

Saint Domingo said:
In the long run yes, but if a top manager had this squad I think it would get top 4. We should at least be challenging. We have more firepower than Spurs or Liverpool and a better defence yet we're absolutely nowhere near and floundered in the bottom half of the table last season. If Klopp took us over I believe we'd be fifth minimum and with the way Unired seem to stutter along why not a run at fourth? With Martinez though I fear there is no chance, we have already dropped 4 points this season in games a top 4 side would expect to win. Chelsea game will reveal a lot I think, a bad loss and we are heading for last season again. A win and we might ride a wave of confidence for a while. We need to show we can start winning at home again. Our record recently is terrible.
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We have 1 very good striker, that is not "We have more firepower than Spurs or Liverpool"

Better defence....maybe individually, but that does not make a 'better defence' imo.

Klopp once got a team relegated, and was terrible last season, don't forget that.

We have only lost to 1 team, and even in that game we played well and battled toe to toe with them, but for the odd £50 million player.

No manager in world football with automatically turn us into top 4, unless they get given massive money, that is the truth of it all.
 

Pabbers said:
We have 1 very good striker, that is not "We have more firepower than Spurs or Liverpool"

Better defence....maybe individually, but that does not make a 'better defence' imo.

Klopp once got a team relegated, and was terrible last season, don't forget that.

We have only lost to 1 team, and even in that game we played well and battled toe to toe with them, but for the odd £50 million player.

No manager in world football with automatically turn us into top 4, unless they get given massive money, that is the truth of it all.
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Lukaku, Mirallas, Deulofeu, Barkley. Apart from Kane I can't think of players from either side you'd have in a front four over these?

Your point on the defence is my point exactly. We have better individuals but they are not a good defence....because of the manager.

All you have to say is would Mourinho or Ferguson, or Wenger or Pellegrini have us top 4? Most probably yes. I know they're some of the best prem managers but my point is finances help a lot but we can get a better manager than Martinez who could crack the top 4 without huge financial outlay.
 
Shouldnt be the question be aimed at the board rather than the manager? Just saying?

Personally i dont see how Roberto can. He can barely name players to play in their natural positions each week.
 
maccavennie said:
I don't think Martinez will get us there but I think he will have put things in place that his successor will bear the fruits of ( such as youth, good first team squad ).

Personally I just don't think he gets the best out of the players at his disposal, certainly not enough consistently over the course of 38 games to break into the top 4. For me, other teams spending more than us is just as it is. If we go by that rule of thumb, our players all cost more and earn more money than Watfords team so why didn't we win? Tactics/playing style/substitutions/luck all play a part on getting the results required.

Only game this season where there was a difference in class was City and I still felt we didn't play to our full potential and still we had a couple of chances ourselves when the score was level.
Click to expand...

I get what you're saying but with the Watford example, anything can happen in a one off game. Over the course of a season, or over the course of a few years, clearly money talks. City didn't get to where they are through good managers.
 
Pabbers said:
Its not the manager that is stopping us, its finances.
Click to expand...

Both need to improve imo, but our squad is stronger than some would have you believe, the drop in expectations since Moyes left and stopped 'lowering our expectations' is massive.

This squad we have, with the money Martinez has spent to bring in quality reinforcements to an already quality side, should be capable of holding their own against any team..

More often than not we will lose to the few bigger clubs in the league, but there is no reason why we cannot cause a few upsets and keep upsets against us to a minimum, that's all that's needed to challenge for fourth.

Our squad is quality, but we wont get close. We are just not very good at team goals, relying on individual brilliance too often for my liking and combined with defensively being a bit of a mess.

Hopefully we can be better, early signs are reasonably good this season, but the next month or so will tell us so much about this squad, its strength, and the mentality of our players and the manager.

Its far from impossible, but I still can't see it happening.. come on Martinez.. prove me wrong.
 

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