Everton 6-1 SK Brann - 21st Feb 20:00

[HalewoodB]

umm I hope moyes has made the right decision and trust he has, maybe he has already done a deal behind the scenes for another player come the summer who knows, it would make sense signing cars to slowly bring in the new player if you know what I mean . Whats even more exciting is not only talking about replacements and players but where we have ended up with the squad! I mean wow champions league next season a good possibilty *fingers and toes crossed no more injuries* and with the chance of winning the uefa cup this season..its completely mind blowing considering where have come from in the past 10 so or years.

I also cant believe how time as flown and moyes has been with us for 6 years 0.o Time flies with moysie and the team hehe.

Was this supposed to be in the Carsley thread as well?

 

[ToxtethBlue]

few doubted yaks ability, just his character and temperament.

munny hasnt endeared himself to the supporters yet, his turn around in the summer isnt easily forgot, and his lapses last season count against him. that he hasnt been anything like as good his inclement form from last season is really saying something.

he'll get till the end of the season, and maybe he will come good.

i cant forgive a player with no heart, and munny has shown little if any as yet.

Everyone doubted Yak's ability. He looked like a pub player when he joined but he was given time to adjust and now look at him.

Lapses in concentration? Please explain. In my eyes he was one of the main reasons along with James Vaughan that we cemented the European place. They gave us a freshness and we looked a much better team technically and physically. Manny helped us play football and Vaughan gave us directness and pace.

I don't buy the no heart crap. Why has he got no heart? Because he doesn't run around like a mad man and dive into challenges? The fact of the matter is every player expresses them self differently on a football pitch. We'd all love players like Cahill and Vaughan who are aggressive and look like they'd die for the cause but there are also players like Fernandes, Yakubu and Anichebe who are laid back but that doesn't mean they don't care.

 

[TX Bill]

few doubted yaks ability, just his character and temperament.

munny hasnt endeared himself to the supporters yet, his turn around in the summer isnt easily forgot, and his lapses last season count against him. that he hasnt been anything like as good his inclement form from last season is really saying something.

he'll get till the end of the season, and maybe he will come good.

i cant forgive a player with no heart, and munny has shown little if any as yet.

Yeah...except the supposed many Boro supporters out there who said they got the better end of that deal when it was announced.

Speak for yourself though Suits when you say his turn around in the summer isn't easily forgotten. However if that's what's holding supporters back from backing him, then fair enough. I'm not asking supporters to be endeared with him. I'm asking them to give him the same amount of time other Everton players have had, all things being equal.

His lapses last season count against him? Yet the times he had good form don't count? No logic there. And then I think we've all been down the road as to why his form hasn't been what it was last season. Perhaps the fact that he played very little at Valencia I'm sure has nothing at all to do with it.

 

[HalewoodB]

Everyone doubted Yak's ability. He looked like a pub player when he joined but he was given time to adjust and now look at him.

Lapses in concentration? Please explain. In my eyes he was one of the main reasons along with James Vaughan that we cemented the European place. They gave us a freshness and we looked a much better team technically and physically. Manny helped us play football and Vaughan gave us directness and pace.

I don't buy the no heart crap. Why has he got no heart? Because he doesn't run around like a mad man and dive into challenges? The fact of the matter is every player expresses them self differently on a football pitch. We'd all love players like Cahill and Vaughan who are aggressive and look like they'd die for the cause but there are also players like Fernandes, Yakubu and Anichebe who are laid back but that doesn't mean they don't care.

No-one doubted his ability, his stats of best striker currently playing in the prem of the last 3yrs backed that up. The question was would he knuckle down and embrace Moyes demands for workrate and fitness.

 

[SuitsBlue]

you dont become a lazy fat [Poor language removed] overnight, it takes a month or two of southgates plug ugly mug chunnering away to demotivate a player whose work ethic and reliability were questionable well before his prem debut.

concentration - looking for the pass, availabilty for the pass, tracking back and covering your man, positional acumen, playing till the whistle.

heart for me? martyn playing through injury that eventually finished him, AJ playing for the cause and running himself into the ground though injured, in pain and needing surgery still showed up and put a full shift in. heart is what makes a machine more than the sum of its parts. no retreat, no surrender, fight on the beaches, fight on the field, live for the fight, die for the cause.

 

[Cal]

Dont know why people were saying Manny wasnt that good last season.

Played great against Pompey and changed the game completely against West Ham and Arsenal too.

Other notable performances, Watford, Blackburn, Reading and had a decent games against Chelsea.

 

[SuitsBlue]

Yeah...except the supposed many Boro supporters out there who said they got the better end of that deal when it was announced.

Speak for yourself though Suits when you say his turn around in the summer isn't easily forgotten. However if that's what's holding supporters back from backing him, then fair enough. I'm not asking supporters to be endeared with him. I'm asking them to give him the same amount of time other Everton players have had, all things being equal.

His lapses last season count against him? Yet the times he had good form don't count? No logic there. And then I think we've all been down the road as to why his form hasn't been what it was last season. Perhaps the fact that he played very little at Valencia I'm sure has nothing at all to do with it.

you have relied on pienaar to make the point.

munny has played in total 9 then 5 games for us.
pienaar has played in total 16 games for us so far.

is the difference of two games really the reason for the vast vast vast difference in quality seen on the field?

 

[TX Bill]

I like players that play like that as well. I think we all do. But I'm pretty sure (remember though, I don't know my football so take this for what it's worth) that not every player is built like that. I can't sit here and say that because a player doesn't demonstrate all of the qualities you just listed, that he has no heart. All players are different when it comes to how they play on the pitch and how they channel their drive and energy.

Lost me though on the concentration comment. Is that concerning Yak's play at Boro?

 

[HalewoodB]

Dont know why people were saying Manny wasnt that good last season.

Played great against Pompey and changed the game completely against West Ham and Arsenal too.

Other notable performances, Watford, Blackburn, Reading and had a decent games against Chelsea.

Thought he showed some nice touches and at times some real promise but thats all. He never controlled a game and since he has been back he has shown little if nothing of that promise

 

[TX Bill]

you have relied on pienaar to make the point.

munny has played in total 9 then 5 games for us.
pienaar has played in total 16 games for us so far.

is the difference of two games really the reason for the vast vast vast difference in quality seen on the field?

Sure it can be. Does the word "fitness" mean anything to you?

Come on Suits, think hard. I'm sure you've heard the term and how it's used.

 

[SuitsBlue]

when roy keane got the manure boot, he went running everyday and flogged himself stupid running against his dog on a local park.

andre agassi used to sprint up a very steep hill till he was physically sick and could run no more.

our former prodigy got into boxing in a big way besides playing football, and kept it going whilst playing first team prem stuff.

players have to bare some responsibility for their own fitness. responsibility, to themselves and to their career.

i didnt make munny sign for valencia, i didnt upset koeman, how old is he? 21 or 22? if he is unmotivated and unfit at this age, then we need to really consider just how much we need this special talent, and just how often he will feel like 'turning it on'.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Football was never the same for me after I left Everton and although I always wanted to win, losing never really seemed to hurt anymore."[/FONT]

 

[TX Bill]

Suits, you asked me why a vast difference in quality on the field between him and Pienaar regarding roughly the same amount of matches and I answered you. I believe that when Manny has a few more games under his belt, we'll see improved performances.

Don't know what you're on about regarding Roy Keane, Agassi, but apparently you're privy to the innerworkings of Manny and his mental makeup that the rest of us are not.

Who gives a crap if he signed for Valencia? What's that got to do with it? Your question was answered and yet you want to continue to overlook to obvious.

Thank god you aren't manager or we'd have a squad full of guys with nothing but all heart and are motiviated by running up hills or boxing.

They wouldn't have a lick of skill in their bones but hey, they'll have heart...

...and they'd be playing in the Championship the next year.

 

[SuitsBlue]

cant have eleven mincers on the pitch, the softer players need the reassurance of an honest clogger.

peter reid.

he'd kick satan for the everton cause that man.

pienaar we got on the cheap because he fell out with the boss at dortmund. sound familiar? player on the peripherals of the squad, picked on by the manager, not getting games, being blamed for attitude and effort.

Don't know what you're on about regarding Roy Keane, Agassi, but apparently you're privy to the innerworkings of Manny and his mental makeup that the rest of us are not.

two edged sword - cuts both ways.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"I'd break every bone in my body for any club I play for but I'd die for Everton"[/FONT]

 

[trueblues1985]

Personally id still say give him a chance, if it turns out he isnt for us, then by all means lets get another in. He is on loan, hasnt been bought, and for that let's see how he meanders through the rest of the season..am sure moyes will kick him out if he isnt playing as well has he could or should be.
A firm hand is what this player needs, and moyes seems to have this ability in abundance, in motivating and encouraging players.

It's swings and roundabouts, the lad has talent there is no denying it, but as you rightly state suits...he needs to take full responsibility of his own fitness..he cant blame anyone but himself for his lack of it...but my slight concern is as you have said...fitness aside he doesnt seem that interested...heart on sleeve maybe?

Regardless id give him to the end of the season to prove himself, he still has a long way to go on that front...but i wouldnt sacrifice piennar for manny...if manny wants to prove himself..then he ought to fight to get into the team like everyone else...no special preferential treatment..if he doesnt break in when given chances...then we have lost nothing.

 

[ToxtethBlue]

No-one doubted his ability, his stats of best striker currently playing in the prem of the last 3yrs backed that up. The question was would he knuckle down and embrace Moyes demands for workrate and fitness.

I think alot of us did. I always thought he'd come good but I was surprised how poor he was in his first 7/8 games. He didn't looks quick, his touch looked poor and to be honest he looked a little over weight.

But since probably around the Derby County/Birmingham game he's been excellent. He a far better footballer than I thought. His vision, ability to hold the ball up and finishing are excellent and as you've said he's also working a little harder.