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Hilary Benn Sacked From The Shadow Cabinet - wider political debate

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rascal said:
Lemmings-OnlyFloatersCanSurviveThis.gif
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None of that happened though. It's the mainstream media on a witch hunt to protect the status quo of the establishment.

Obviously.
 
The Esk said:
4. Scrap Trident
5. Given the electorate have determined Brexit, act immediately to maintain our single market membership, even at the expense of freedom of movement.
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Unfortunately can't agree on a few points there. Scrapping trident, I know it's a divisive issue and a huge waste of money on something we'll never use, but that's why we have them. It's a terrible, sickening world we live in but MAD is a valid threat despite more enemies coming from non conventional sources nowadays. If we got rid I'm sure 99% we would be fine, but what if that 1% happens?? I'm all for cutting costs though, I'm sure we could do without 4 subs, one is for training FFS!! I'm sure a VR computer program could be knocked up to help with that. We could also cut the number of warheads, not much of a saving granted but every penny helps, it should be a case of MVP where trident is concerned.

As for keeping the common market, if the EU hold firm in saying you have to have free movement of people for that, we will have riots on our hands seeing immigration was all anybody (slight exaggeration there, excuse me, almost all) cared about. In fact i will start one considering I voted yes and if we end up with the same thing but with no say I will not be happy.

Investing in infrastructure projects would be good. I can't believe we are going to pay through our noses for Hinckley Point C, paying back far more than needs putting in to foreign governments when we could build ourselves a tidal barrier across the Severn for less than half the cost and that will produce more energy than the nuclear power station.

Oh I know why we can't, the green brigade, cause obviously the disturbance of wetlands up stream would be worse outcome than a meltdown. Some people need to get their priorities straight, much like the trade unionists that voted for JC. ;)
 
The binman chronicles said:
Unfortunately can't agree on a few points there. Scrapping trident, I know it's a divisive issue and a huge waste of money on something we'll never use, but that's why we have them. It's a terrible, sickening world we live in but MAD is a valid threat despite more enemies coming from non conventional sources nowadays. If we got rid I'm sure 99% we would be fine, but what if that 1% happens?? I'm all for cutting costs though, I'm sure we could do without 4 subs, one is for training FFS!! I'm sure a VR computer program could be knocked up to help with that. We could also cut the number of warheads, not much of a saving granted but every penny helps, it should be a case of MVP where trident is concerned.

As for keeping the common market, if the EU hold firm in saying you have to have free movement of people for that, we will have riots on our hands seeing immigration was all anybody (slight exaggeration there, excuse me, almost all) cared about. In fact i will start one considering I voted yes and if we end up with the same thing but with no say I will not be happy.

Investing in infrastructure projects would be good. I can't believe we are going to pay through our noses for Hinckley Point C, paying back far more than needs putting in to foreign governments when we could build ourselves a tidal barrier across the Severn for less than half the cost and that will produce more energy than the nuclear power station.

Oh I know why we can't, the green brigade, cause obviously the disturbance of wetlands up stream would be worse outcome than a meltdown. Some people need to get their priorities straight, much like the trade unionists that voted for JC. ;)
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Always offer points you're prepared to concede :) I'd trade Trident certainly to get that manifesto away ;)
 

The Esk said:
Always offer points you're prepared to concede :) I'd trade Trident certainly to get that manifesto away ;)
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Cunning! Put something controversial into the mix that draws attention and focus. You are then willing to remove said policy after much debate, thus showing movement on your side to push through other less controversial items!

Don't think I can trust you anymore.... :p:)
 
catcherintherye said:
I'll be honest I am not entirely sold on the idea that MP's who tend to be millionaires, with lots of support and second homes etc are really bullied by party voters and supporters. In the main they are held to account and increasingly they don't like that. That is reasonable, its never nice to be held to account but I'm not sure that's bullying.

They shouldn't have to go Independent though. What they do is up to them and I'm not really a fan of de-selection. I only commented on what I would do. If I worked for someone and felt a decision they took was so awful I wouldn't try to put it into action then rather than spending my life moaning about it I would leave and put my ideas to the test.

Likewise if I was an MP and thought the decision my party had taken was so awful we wouldn't win any votes I would prove this by standing as an independent and putting my ideas to the test.

Ed Miliband opposed the 3 pound fees mate. The Labour right (Blairite right) insisted upon it against his wishes. They naively felt that the majority of people outside of Labour are to the right of them. What they've found is that most seem to be to the left.

As for the 3 quid thing, nobody paid 3 quid got a vote at this election. It was 25 quid. I can only comment for myself but I've been paying much higher subs that that for some time now. Either way Corbyn has won in every category, 25 pound sign up,s 3 pound sign ups, members and trade union affiliates. It's just not true to say 3 pound sign ups swung it. Corbyn was the most popular candidate amongst every category.
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Do you really no what is going on because I cannot understand where your facts are
Ed Miliband 'should apologise for ridiculous leadership rules'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33976474
 
The Esk said:
Always offer points you're prepared to concede :) I'd trade Trident certainly to get that manifesto away ;)
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No chance of trident going the trade Unions need that for a workforce Len Macdonald would scupper corbyn on that deffo nailed on too many jobs involved or you could just let corbyn build the submarines with no warheads has he proposed urm that suggest to me he is rubbish!
 
Tubey said:
There it is again.

We're all Tories everyone. For, you know, wanting a viable opposition to the Tories.

Classic.
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So erm, this opposition to the tories, when the majority PLP have gone along with austerity measures?

They keep imitating tories with a touch of conscience, hence the pale blue reference on the spectrum. You say classic, I say classless.
 

Joey66 said:
Do you really no what is going on because I cannot understand where your facts are
Ed Miliband 'should apologise for ridiculous leadership rules'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33976474
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Thanks for the link mate. Miliband ended up agreeing and it was "on his watch" it was introduced. It is known he wasn't the biggest fan of that and it was Blairites like Harriet Harman who pushed for it. It has been known that since the days of Kinnock the Labour right wanted to move towards One member one vote as it's more democratic. They have now subsequently found members don't agree with them so want to rig the process again!

It is a none argument though mate. Corbyn has won in every category, from longstanding members, to trade union sign ups as well as those who paid the 1 off fee. I can understand why people might not like him but he did win every category.
 
magicjuan said:
So erm, this opposition to the tories, when the majority PLP have gone along with austerity measures?

They keep imitating tories with a touch of conscience, hence the pale blue reference on the spectrum. You say classic, I say classless.
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There is very much an ethical issue at play with that. More importantly though there is a practical issue that there just isn't a space for that type of party anymore. The job of mediating between unions and management is no longer required at governmental level. Nor is there the money to make redistributive payments off the back off economic growth that characterised New Labour. This is a big part of why people didn't vote for them, as while they liked the policies they just weren't credible. Further emphasising a 90's approach will only make them look more unrealistic in their assessment.

Whether you like Corbyn or more pertinently like his policies is fair enough. I can understand why redistribution would be unpopular with some people. However at least there is an honesty there to see we will get money to redistribute through taxation as opposed to relying on a mythical growth.
 

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