Kevin Thelwell - New Director of Football

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allen said:
Yeah, I'm torn on Moyes.

At the time, I felt it was the right thing for both parties. I was frankly astounded that United wanted him when they could've had pretty much anyone, and I shared the general opinion of most Evertonians that he'd taken us as far as he was going to.

But I think the stability and care with which he ran the club was something I underestimated at the time. His steady stewardship masked the deficiencies elsewhere in the football club, and Moshiri's kid in a sweetshop approach to owning a football club has since exposed them all.

If he'd stayed, we probably would be doing a lot better than we are now - but I don't think we'd have won anything, either.

I do like the shout of him being a director of football rather than a manager, but I don't know if it would've worked to bring a new manager in under him - or even if he'd ever accept that kind of role.

Hopefully Thelwell is both capable and strong-willed enough to sort us out. Someone needs to.
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I think David Moyes is a really good manager but I think his ceiling is probably top six.
We certainly would be in a better place if we had appointed him last summer but I don't think we would ever be a top four team.
 
Pabbers said:
Thats not even true, he headed the ball for years in International footy, Europe and Serie A fine.
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Yeah I know I have said that before in the past myself.

It was always a weird one though, a manager who tended to do his due diligence binning a player off after 1 and a half games and what, 3 months? Such an odd signing.
 
blueblue said:
I think David Moyes is a really good manager but I think his ceiling is probably top six.
We certainly would be in a better place if we had appointed him last summer but I don't think we would ever be a top four team.
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I think it would have been interesting to see what had happened if Moyes had stayed on and Moshiri came in. The Utd job was always going to turn toxic after Fergie left. You couldn’t reasonably expect most managers to replicate his level of success.

Given where we are now, someone able to get us into the top 6 regularly would be an absolute dream. One thing Moshiri was right about was that the club had a small window to exploit its relative wealth and push on. We absolutely blew that chance and now top 4 looks further away than it has since before Moyes came in.
 
Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
Is it?

Still waiting for that evidence

Again, if you're going to go in strong on someone you should probably have something to back it up

All you've done is spew bile at someone with nothing to support it

Eggs doesn't need me to stand up for them as they are capable to do so themselves, but it doesn't sit right with me to see a good poster attacked in such a manner when you seemingly have nothing to back your attack up
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I, still have, an extremely well paid and interesting employment with as just about the most varied and different ideals and targets. Not bragging, merely stating facts.
I grew up on a council estate and attended a secondary modern school and had a hunger to attain more. Did I have a feeling I wished for better things? Oh yes! I was not of the working class hero type who proclaimed, 'that I am working class and proud of it'. 'I am a working class lad and not ashamed of it' type. Hunger and desire.
Should I win the, say, lottery, would my dedication still be the same to my work?
Answer; not a sodding chance.

I'm with the @Eggs and @Mikey_Fitzgerald et al logic centres.
 

bring back the catt said:
I, still have, an extremely well paid and interesting employment with as just about the most varied and different ideals and targets. Not bragging, merely stating facts.
I grew up on a council estate and attended a secondary modern school and had a hunger to attain more. Did I have a feeling I wished for better things? Oh yes! I was not of the working class hero type who proclaimed, 'that I am working class and proud of it'. 'I am a working class lad and not ashamed of it' type. Hunger and desire.
Should I win the, say, lottery, would my dedication still be the same to my work?
Answer; not a sodding chance.

I'm with the @Eggs and @Mikey_Fitzgerald et al logic centres.
Click to expand...
Those lottery winners who say it won't change them......why bother entering?
 

There were many many more world class players in earlier times. tactics and team play have stifled creativity. I don't care what anyone says, football these days is nowhere near as exciting. Teams play to not lose rather than to win and the same two guys have dominated for over 15 years, that never happened before.

I personally think the Premier Leagues best days were about mid 90's to mid 00's the amount of world class players around in those days was amazing.

Hope Kevin can find us some gems.
 
bring back the catt said:
I, still have, an extremely well paid and interesting employment with as just about the most varied and different ideals and targets. Not bragging, merely stating facts.
I grew up on a council estate and attended a secondary modern school and had a hunger to attain more. Did I have a feeling I wished for better things? Oh yes! I was not of the working class hero type who proclaimed, 'that I am working class and proud of it'. 'I am a working class lad and not ashamed of it' type. Hunger and desire.
Should I win the, say, lottery, would my dedication still be the same to my work?
Answer; not a sodding chance.

I'm with the @Eggs and @Mikey_Fitzgerald et al logic centres.
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Whilst I agree with the sentiment you’ve also benefited from a large amount of luck, right company with right people at right time in whatever market you serve. Not to talk down your achievements which sound. Many talented and from same background won’t have had them breaks and therefore won’t attain the success you did mate.
 
Those accounts were horrific. It’s clear that the status quo is not sustainable.

Oddly enough, an old interview with Ralf Rangnick - the same chap who used to travel from Brighton to Goodison to watch the 80s team, and who Everton turned down twice - came up on my YouTube recently about how he turned RB Salzburg/Leipzig into Champions League clubs. It’s worth a watch when you have the time. If you don’t, the key points are:
  • Only scout players between 17-22 (max 23)
  • ‘When a player is 23, they are no longer a talent’
  • Only target footballers who have signed one or maximum two professional contracts
  • Create a way of playing - in this case, energetic pressing to match Red Bull’s give you wings motto - and then scout players with matching attributes
  • Aside from a few core players, anticipate selling signings for double their transfer price in two years. No drama. Just make sure you’ve already signed their replacement and have them developing at your sister club
I’d say Everton’s transfer policy since Moshiri came in has been the complete opposite to nearly all of those points, bar the odd exception

The interview with Rangnick is from 2014 and many clubs e.g. Leicester, Brighton, Rennes have been following the above for a while now. I’m just hoping that with Thelwell’s work at NYRB and experience with UK academies, he will bring in the same approach

https://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/threads/kevin-thelwell-new-director-of-football.114562/
 
allen said:
Yeah, I'm torn on Moyes.

At the time, I felt it was the right thing for both parties. I was frankly astounded that United wanted him when they could've had pretty much anyone, and I shared the general opinion of most Evertonians that he'd taken us as far as he was going to.

But I think the stability and care with which he ran the club was something I underestimated at the time. His steady stewardship masked the deficiencies elsewhere in the football club, and Moshiri's kid in a sweetshop approach to owning a football club has since exposed them all.

If he'd stayed, we probably would be doing a lot better than we are now - but I don't think we'd have won anything, either.

I do like the shout of him being a director of football rather than a manager, but I don't know if it would've worked to bring a new manager in under him - or even if he'd ever accept that kind of role.

Hopefully Thelwell is both capable and strong-willed enough to sort us out. Someone needs to.
Click to expand...

We needed a change and so did Moyes. So while it's all gone awry for is since, I don't regret it as such.

Certainly, though, how reliant the club was on him running the entire operation gets more and more evident with every passing season. He deserves a great deal of credit for that.
 
SirBarryHorrrrrne said:
Those accounts were horrific. It’s clear that the status quo is not sustainable.

Oddly enough, an old interview with Ralf Rangnick - the same chap who used to travel from Brighton to Goodison to watch the 80s team, and who Everton turned down twice - came up on my YouTube recently about how he turned RB Salzburg/Leipzig into Champions League clubs. It’s worth a watch when you have the time. If you don’t, the key points are:
  • Only scout players between 17-22 (max 23)
  • ‘When a player is 23, they are no longer a talent’
  • Only target footballers who have signed one or maximum two professional contracts
  • Create a way of playing - in this case, energetic pressing to match Red Bull’s give you wings motto - and then scout players with matching attributes
  • Aside from a few core players, anticipate selling signings for double their transfer price in two years. No drama. Just make sure you’ve already signed their replacement and have them developing at your sister club
I’d say Everton’s transfer policy since Moshiri came in has been the complete opposite to nearly all of those points, bar the odd exception

The interview with Rangnick is from 2014 and many clubs e.g. Leicester, Brighton, Rennes have been following the above for a while now. I’m just hoping that with Thelwell’s work at NYRB and experience with UK academies, he will bring in the same approach

https://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/threads/kevin-thelwell-new-director-of-football.114562/
Click to expand...

Ive been advocating this since we last won the FA Cup.

Its just common sense on how to bridge the spending gulf between Everton and the elite teams.
 

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