"sixth, seventh or eighth the best Everton can do"

[Timak]

Every single person in this thread agrees with you.

The difference is, you're the only person who thinks that's literally the only factor involved.

To use yet another crap analogy, in your eyes, the matter at hand is black and white. The reality is that it's grey.

If money was the sole factor, you'd pay minimum wage to the groundskeeper to wear a suit on the touchline every week and not bother with a manager.

Then I'm clearly missing some subtle point.

We are all agreed that:

All the teams that finish above us spend £50-£150m more than Everton every season.
Only once in the last 6 years has a team with a similar spend finished above Everton (Newcastle last year)
No other manager has outperformed Moyes consistently (e.g more than one season) on a similar budget in the past decade.
Everton have got the 5th best record in the league in his time in charge
Moyes has a superb, unrivalled record in the transfer market for similar clubs

Yet we seem to be coming to radically different conclusions.

Mine is Moyes is the single factor that is stopping Everton from reverting to a lower midtable club

Others is that we need to change the manager to reach the "next level"

I've presented my evidence(you know actual stats and stuff) as to why I think I'm right. I'm yet to see anything other to convince me as to why getting rid would be the right thing to do.

 

[D410]

Then don't try.

You have neither the word power nor the writing skills.

And don't try and patronise other fans whom take a different viewpoint to yourself.

What is "blindingly obvious" to you is a hazy fog to others.

Suffice it to say that two non wealthy minor clubs contested a Wembley final yesterday, in a competition we bowed out of in September.

So don't tell me that teams can only achieve success by dint of a "regular injection of money".

We aren't looking for the moon and the stars here, just some bang for our buck.

And by Jove out manager earns plenty of bucks.

The owner said he was the best manager in the world and paid him millions over the last 11 years.....should bill go as well on the basis

 

[D410]

If we were playing in the FA Cup semi final against Blackburn he'd still try to play down our chances 'Theyre the form team going into this' it really has just gone all too stale. It's time for change and I for one can't wait, the thought of another ten years of this is just horrible.

If we did make a change and it did get worse how would you feel then?

 

[Timak]

The owner said he was the best manager in the world and paid him millions over the last 11 years.....should bill go as well on the basis

Clearly all other managers should resign too.

After all they have voted him as the best manager in the league 3 times.

And failed to finish above his team despite tens of millions more to spend.

But Swansea beat a league 2 team in a devalued cup competition so the previous decades worth of results are null and void/

 

[GwladysBlue]

Then I'm clearly missing some subtle point.

We are all agreed that:

All the teams that finish above us spend £50-£150m more than Everton every season.
Only once in the last 6 years has a team with a similar spend finished above Everton (Newcastle last year)
No other manager has outperformed Moyes consistently (e.g more than one season) on a similar budget in the past decade.
Everton have got the 5th best record in the league in his time in charge
Moyes has a superb, unrivalled record in the transfer market for similar clubs

Yet we seem to be coming to radically different conclusions.

Mine is Moyes is the single factor that is stopping Everton from reverting to a lower midtable club

Others is that we need to change the manager to reach the "next level"

I've presented my evidence(you know actual stats and stuff) as to why I think I'm right. I'm yet to see anything other to convince me as to why getting rid would be the right thing to do.

Football is an entertainment business and I am certainly not being entertained with Moyes' football. It's boring and when it comes to the big chances to push us on he has failed time and time again. 'Unrivalled record in the transfer market' Well I wish someone else had of been in charge of spending that Lescott money because he pissed it away on utter rubbish. We were crying out for a pacy winger and striker yet he buys two CBs and Bilyaletdinov.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Timak - Swansea won the League cup mate, that now makes Moyes a failure.

You're wasting your time, facts will never win over nonsensical, subjective, baseless, one eyed opinion, amongst the armchair experts, who've been calling for the flavour of the moment manager to replace Moyes for season after season. Only after he's gone & we're bombing under some clown like Martinez will they fully realise what Moyes achieved here

 

[D410]

Clearly all other managers should resign too.

After all they have voted him as the best manager in the league 3 times.

And failed to finish above his team despite tens of millions more to spend.

But Swansea beat a league 2 team in a devalued cup competition so the previous decades worth of results are null and void/

see, here is the thing with me on Moyes....I have fell out with Moyes for now after 11 years this season but he could bounce back again.

It,s lazy to blame an unsigned contract for poor defending all season or that fans miss the big picture off the pitch or that they are downright disloyal to a man who dug us out of the **** on pennys to give us CLF or days out at wembley or finishing above liverpool.

 

[Timak]

If we were playing in the FA Cup semi final against Blackburn he'd still try to play down our chances 'Theyre the form team going into this' it really has just gone all too stale. It's time for change and I for one can't wait, the thought of another ten years of this is just horrible.

Melodrama alert.

Between 1992-2002 we finished in the top 10 once - we escaped relegation on the last day of the season twice and used to be beaten by 4-5 goals every time we played a decent team.

In the last 10 years we've been outside the top 8 twice, finishing 11th and 17th and got the 5th most points of any club in the league.

The only thing that was good in the 1990's was winning the FA Cup. Other than that we were ****e.

Look at how depressing this place is after we dropped some points. Imagine if we were doing that every week.

 

[GwladysBlue]

If we did make a change and it did get worse how would you feel then?

I'd feel like at least we've took a gamble to try move on instead of this overwhelming feeling of boredom towards Everton and our current state. We haven't won a game by more than one goal since September that show you Moyes all too cautious approach which ironically has ended up costing us countless late goals due to changes and dropping back forcing pressure on us.
Do yo want this every year for God knows how long?

 

[D410]

Football is an entertainment business and I am certainly not being entertained with Moyes' football. It's boring and when it comes to the big chances to push us on he has failed time and time again. 'Unrivalled record in the transfer market' Well I wish someone else had of been in charge of spending that Lescott money because he pissed it away on utter rubbish. We were crying out for a pacy winger and striker yet he buys two CBs and Bilyaletdinov.

so you,d rather we entertain than win. Not sure they have invented a cup for that yet.

 

[D410]

I'd feel like at least we've took a gamble to try move on instead of this overwhelming feeling of boredom towards Everton and our current state. We haven't won a game by more than one goal since September that show you Moyes all too cautious approach which ironically has ended up costing us countless late goals due to changes and dropping back forcing pressure on us.
Do yo want this every year for God knows how long?

I share the same ambition of the owner get to 40pts on our budget.

 

[GwladysBlue]

so you,d rather we entertain than win. Not sure they have invented a cup for that yet.

Swansea have just benefitted from entertaining.

 

[electricblue]

It may just be the upset of throwing away 19 points from winning positions, or throwing away 5 points against the likes of Norwich, but I'm fed up with Moyes being 'realistic' and talking the team down. Great managers generate passion and winning mentalities within their teams. Moyes sometimes does that but ALWAYS falls short when it's balls on the line time. Laudrup waltzes in and picks up a trophy with a club that's never won sod all, that's because he was a winner, KKK kicked the sh!te out of Moyes last year with an inferior team because he too is a winner. Davey is a safe pair of hands, full stop, and will never be a winner...........I've had it with the man......

Steady on pal. Bad as it was, it was us who fielded a weakened team at Klanfield not them.

And we DESPERATELY missed Pienaar at Wembley before Distin's mistake handed them the initiative.

I understand the criticism of Moyes here but you're giving Dogleash too much credit.

 

[D410]

Swansea have just benefitted from entertaining.

I,d take our league position over the carling cup all day long.

 

[Tubey]

Timak - Swansea won the League cup mate, that now makes Moyes a failure.

You're wasting your time, facts will never win over nonsensical, subjective, baseless, one eyed opinion, amongst the armchair experts, who've been calling for the flavour of the moment manager to replace Moyes for season after season. Only after he's gone & we're bombing under some clown like Martinez will they fully realise what Moyes achieved here